Part 2

Describe the process of working together, please. What was different from your expectations and what did the other add to the music?

Philipp: Alex started composing the core structure of the piece. We then exchanged ideas about playing techniques, the sound design of the electronics, recording setups, etc. I recorded the piano at Greenhouse Studios in Iceland. Alex and I then created the electronic textures from the E-bow recordings I made.

While I did the Spatial Audio/Dolby Atmos mix of the piece, he created this wonderful artwork that became the basis for the track cover, and we also produced a limited edition of prints of it.


Single Form (Figure & Landscape Image) by Philipp Rumsch & Alex Groves

Alex: What I really enjoyed about the process was that I could trust Philipp to go away, work on the piece and come back with it sounding better than he’d found it. It felt like although we didn’t have a defined end goal, we both trusted each other to make decision about the direction of the piece because we were excited to see where they would lead.

When Philipp suggested mixing it in Dolby Atmos it made perfect sense, because as the piece had developed it had become more and more about creating this sonic landscape which enveloped the listener so a spatialised recording really suited that.

[Read our Bob Clearmountain Interview about Mixing in Atmos]

Is there a piece which shows the different aspects you each contributed to the process particularly clearly?

Philipp: When Alex talked about the influence of Barbara Hepworth on his work I immediately felt that Single Form (Figure & Landscape) is more of a spatial or installative composition rather than a conventional time based piece.

Since I had my first binaural audio experience as a teenager with Pearl Jam’s “Binaural” album (yes, I had my grunge period …), and especially the track “Soon Forget” I was always a huge of musical settings that exceeded conventional stereo and did a few things live and on other productions.

Accidentally the time we started to work on the piece, Dolby Atmos started to became a thing in music and I know that I wanted to use the technology for this piece.



Alex: I think one piece that was bubbling away in my subconscious when working on this piece is Tristan Perich’s Surface Image. It’s a mad hour-long piece for piano and one bit electronics and I love how the two soundworlds seem to blend seamlessly and yet orbit each other at the same time.

When creating "Single Form (Figure & Landscape)," I wanted to find that same uncanny balance between piano and electronics and Philipp’s idea to create the electronics from samples of the piano made a really nice synthesis between the two elements.



What tend to be the best collaborations in your opinion – those with artists you have a lot in common with or those where you have more differences? What happens when another musician take you outside of your comfort zone?

Philipp: I’ve always been an admirer of projects and collaborations that bring people from the most different genres or disciplines together. Results and perspectives come across that are bigger than the sum of their parts.

When I first heard the Brandt Brauer Frick Ensemble – dark techno played with an ensemble of classical musicians – I was totally blown away.



A lot of the albums from the Bedroom Community label – where people from the most diverse background came together – are an important influence on me.



So are collective / collaborative band formats like Bon Iver.



Alex: I think both of those types of collaborations can have their ups and downs. Collaborating with someone you share a lot in common with can make the initial stages easier as you can quickly agree on things, but actually carving out something new can be a harder task. Whereas working with someone who comes from a completely different perspective can make the early stages pretty challenging but as you start to find common ground its often stranger and more experimental than you would’ve found otherwise.

I think both are important as they create different kinds of opportunities but sometimes the high risk, high reward approach of the second can be really exciting because you have no idea what’ll happen when you start out!

Decisions between creatives often work without words. How did this process work in this case?

Philipp: Quite a lot of emails and Zoom calls, actually. But seriously, one of the things I enjoyed most about working with Alex was that I felt he trusted me from the very beginning, even without knowing me. The exchange was very emphatic and I had the feeling aesthetically we were on the same page during the whole process.

Alex: Yeah, I agree with Philipp. I think that because we were in different places we did need to communicate quite a bit to keep each other in the loop about our ideas but We both knew quite early on that we were on a similar wavelength and that we could always rely on the other to come back to us with something that brought the piece on in ways that we couldn’t have foreseen.

What are your thoughts on the need for compromise vs standing by one's convictions? How did you resolve potential disagreements in this collaboration?

Philipp: I enjoyed collaborating with Alex so much because he gave me the impression that everything he did and wrote had gone through a detailed reflective process beforehand. I knew that whatever he brought to the table would enhance the project and music, presenting ideas and perspectives I would never have thought of before.

Alex: I think we were coming from quite similar starting points so there weren’t really any moments when we were completely at odds with each other.

When that does happen in a collaboration, I think it’s because there’s been a lack of communication earlier on in the process and I’ve certainly had it before. I try and be very open and communicative about how a piece is developing as I work on it so that collaborators can help steer the process as it develops instead of being presented with a finished idea that isn’t what they were expecting.

Was/Is this collaboration fun – does it need to be?

Philipp: I think for me collaboration is such a crucial part of my musical practice because I love to exchange ideas with people, get an insight into their way of thinking etc. And besided that, I just love being around others.

And yes, this collab with Alex has been an absolute joy and I’m beyond happy we got to know each other.

Alex: I think collaboration do need to enrich your practice – Are they always fun? No! – but that’s because you need to be challenged and pushed sometimes to try new things.

Working with Philipp though was a real joy because I felt like we gave each other space to take charge of the project at different moments and supported each other as a kind of outside eye along the way.

Do you find that thanks to this collaboration, you changed certain parts of your process or your outlook on certain creative aspects?

Philipp: Because of this process I definitely learned having the courage in musical processes that take their time to evolve and unfold. And it also definitely changed my way to approach instruments (especially my own piano playing) and seeing them as tools to create a specific compositional idea rather than following the tradition of literature and “how a instrument is supposed to be played”.

Alex: What I loved about working with Philipp was that if he wanted to do something that he didn’t know how to do, he went out and asked for help, researched it, put in the hours to learn about it and then brought it back to the project. I think that’s really inspiring and is something that I want to do more of in the future.

Collaborating with one's heroes can be a thrill or a cause for panic. Do you have any practical experience with this and what was it like?

Philipp: I was lucky enough to have the chance to collaborate with some of my absolute idols, and most of the time it has been a thrill. In 2023 I launched a new collaborative Avant-Pop project called “wylid node”. The idea is to work with different musicians for each song. For the debut single I had the honor to work with Jörg Wähner (drummer for Apparat), Rakhi Singh, AYEN GL and Paula Wünsch – people that are definitely on my list of heroes / heroines – and it has been pure joy.

But, as with any collaboration, it’s important that it happens at eye level, even if it’s someone you look up to. If people are using you or a certain collaboration drains your energy, it’s better to pull the plug.



Alex: I’ve mostly collaborated with my peers so although they are heroes to me, there isn’t that pressure on the relationship.

I think if I did find myself in that position, I’d have to remind myself that they have chosen to work with me just as much as I have chosen to work with them and that in a creative space you can be equals even with different skill sets and experiences because everyone brings their own perspective to the table.