Part 2

Making music, in the beginning, is often playful and about discovery. How do you retain a sense of playfulness and how do you still draw surprises from tools, approaches and musical forms you may be very familiar with?  

James: Luckily for me, writing a new song with my mates is still a playful endeavour full of wonder. There’s so much excitement in discovering a new idea you want to write about.

For me, gratitude is the best antidote to negativity. I feel so blessed every day that I get to make a living by doing something I love more than anything else. I think it’s also important to free up some time to do what we enjoyed as kids. Occasionally, go play with your friends, go to the beach or the park, watch cartoons, and read comics.

The things that we did when school was out for the summer. Be foolish, don’t take yourself too seriously, and have fun. If you want to keep that sense of playfulness, be a kid every once in a while!

Nick: By doing something fun and memorable and enjoying it! Simple. You must enjoy the music and its process. Let it speak to you.

Mark: Keep the kid in you alive! 



Sound, song, and rhythm are all around us, from animal noises to the waves of the ocean. What, if any, are some of the most moving experiences you've had with these non-human-made sounds? In how far would you describe them as “musical”?

James: If four minutes and thirty-three seconds of silence can be considered music, then any sound can be considered music.

In Bali, there’s a day called Nyepi when people would stay in for 24 hours and do nothing. You can’t make any noise, and no lights will be turned on. So, at night, you can be enchanted by the sounds of animals and the stars above. I’m so fortunate to experience this every year, and so many songs have come out of Nyepi from Balinese artists.

Nick: I totally agree with James. Any sound can become a piece of music.

Mark: We’re lucky that we grew up in nature. Living in Bali, we have a lot of natural sounds, from the beaches to the birds. We also grew up to the sounds of modernisation, chainsaws, cement mixers, and the like. These sounds are part of my earliest core memories, and I think they gave me perspectives and textures that shape who I am or my music.

I like gritty “ugly” sounds, but at the same time, I love a smooth, magical melody.

There seems to be an increasing trend to capture music in algorithms, and data. But already at the time of Plato, arithmetic, geometry, and music were considered closely connected. How do you see that connection yourself? What aspects of music do you feel can be captured through numbers, and which cannot?

James: Music is based on scales, harmonies, intervals, and frequencies. All these exhibit patterns that are not too dissimilar to mathematics. Different instruments are built from unique geometries that allow them to create a range of notes. In its essence, music is maths experienced auditorily.

Some genres take this concept to another level. For example, jazz, prog, math rock, and technical death metal experimented with odd and changing time signatures. You can totally visualise a physicist’s blackboard when listening to bands like Animals As Leaders!



Nick: The organisation of sound in music is based on various mathematical principles, such as frequency ratios, rhythms, and harmonies. For example, the intervals between notes in music are based on ratios of the frequencies of sounds, such as the ratio of the frequency of a note to its octave.

Mathematical ratios describe the size and relationship between two or more things, and they come in handy in understanding and performing music. For instance, if a string instrument is plucked so that the entire length of the string (open string) vibrates, a specific pitch, or tone, is made. Musical instruments have specific geometries and very complex subjects.

Mark: I’m not really a numbers guy, so I never considered music from such a perspective. But I’m more than happy to agree with James and Nick’s points of view!

How does the way you make music reflect the way you live your life? Can we learn lessons about life by understanding music on a deeper level?

James: I try my best to be honest in my writing, except for one song so far where I vicariously live out the life of a fictional character. So, all our lyrics reflect our daily lives. We are naturally optimistic people, and as such, a lot of our songs have an optimistic message. Call it naïve, if you may, but we need a bit of hope in this increasingly confusing world. Music serves so many functions.

Some lyricists, like Bob Dylan and Maynard James Keenan, try to explore and uncover deeper meanings in life through their songs. But whatever the lyrics say, learning about the artist’s motivation and journey will always give you an understanding of what it takes to be an artist.

Go talk to a random stranger and truly listen to them. I bet you’ll learn a new point of view on life. You can learn something from anyone and any discipline, including music.

Nick: I agree with James as well.

Mark: If I may paraphrase Rick Rubin again, “If you keep your antennas out, the downloads will come” (laughs).

We can surround ourselves with sound every second of the day. The great pianist Glenn Gould even considered this the ultimate delight. How do you see that yourself, and what importance does silence hold?

James: What a blessing it is that we live in a time where we can keep a magical device in our pocket that allows us to search and listen to almost every song that has ever been written!

It’s important for musicians to always listen to music, just as a novelist should always read books. Not only can it magically invoke emotions and memories, but it also allows you to absorb inspiration.

But silence is equally important, just like unplayed notes are as important as played notes in a song. It gives us space to sort out our thoughts, digest and reflect, and ultimately be inspired to make our art.

Nick: I believe you need balance, and silence plays a key role. We can self-reflect, take a break from music, and restart again. When I take a break from music, I usually feel more inspired or motivated when I return to music.

Mark: With sound, yes. Unless you lock yourself up in a dead silent room, it’s inevitable, right? Sounds are all around us.

With music, however, I like my breaks when I don’t listen to music for certain periods. It helps freshen things up a bit.



Do you feel as though writing or performing a piece of music is inherently different from something like making a great cup of coffee? What do you express through music that you couldn't or wouldn't in more 'mundane' tasks?

James: I believe that all forms of art are the same. They are just different ways that we choose to express ourselves.

All art requires the artist to do certain things. A constant daily grind, whether practising your instrument, finding ideas, or preparing yourself physically. A commitment to the endless pursuit of knowledge, knowing other artists and their lives, learning the history of your art, and even something as simple as conversing with strangers to experience a different perspective. Finally, it requires you to be in touch with your feelings, in tune with your inner monologue, and to reflect on your experiences so that you can immortalise them in your work.

I think that to be able to make a great cup of coffee or to be a great barista, the same level of discipline is required, and in that sense, it's not that different from making music. Music is a great outlet for me to let out my emotions. To express my ideas to others. To give the ego its time in the light. On the daily "mundane" tasks, these are all things that I try my best to manage and control.

The mundane is where the magic happens, where all of our music is written. To quote the Bhagavad Gita, "The mundane and the spiritual are not two separate phenomena".

Nick: I can relate to the question because I love to cook and brew my own coffee at home.

Sure, it can be a mundane task, but if you put in the effort, you can have a good coffee rather than a “meh” coffee. Plus, you can always do a double shot.

Mark: Writing and performing are two very different sides of the same coin, and I envy those who master both! Each side has its aspect in music that you wouldn’t get otherwise, and I think we, as MANJA, all strive for the same thing: always to get better at everything so we can give the best to our fans who have invested their time in us.

If you could make a wish for the future – what are developments in music you would like to see and hear?

James: My one wish for development is not for music itself, but rather for people’s view on becoming a musician.

Parents prefer their kids to take a more “normal” career path. Too often, kids are discouraged from becoming career musicians because their parents want them to be lawyers or doctors. I'm not saying anything bad about lawyers and doctors; we need more. But I wish that more people could see the importance of music and art in general.

One of the marks of a thriving civilisation throughout history is a remarkable range of artists and art, so we also need more musicians!

Nick: I hope to see artists stay true to human art. Many are starting to use AI (Artificial Intelligence) in music or art. AI has come a long way and has significantly improved, and yes, AI can help correct your pitch and allow engineers to mix and master recordings faster and more affordably.

However, writing music without the "intention", which is usually behind it, tends to leave listeners who listen to AI-generated music unsettled by the lack of apparent meaning or storytelling.

Mark: AI! The start of this AI era seems scary initially, and regulations should be made to protect the artists.

However, I don’t think AI can ever replace the human spirit, so we, as artists, should be fine (fingers crossed).

That said, I’m curious to discover how far AI-created music can go, so we’ll see!