Part 2

If music is a language, what can we communicate with it? How do you deal with misunderstandings?

[Lawaun] I think misunderstandings are inevitable. I think it’s ultimately about patience and music can be complex. You can have two people working on one song with two versions of what that song means.

Music's biggest strength can be seen as its biggest weakness. Which would be that there never really is a right or wrong, it's all opinionated. When you think there’s a 'rule' you will find someone who doesn't conform to that and instead sees that as ceiling.

So ultimately it's just about accepting that you can’t understand everything.

[Jamal] I think if music was a language (and I do think it’s a language), the thing we can communicate best is our emotions. Words might not quite be accurate enough to describe how you feel in a specific moment in time but a chord progression might capture it perfectly!

You can tell a lot about someone by their body language, I think the same can be said by someone’s taste in music. Misunderstandings can be very hard for me to deal with, I try my hardest to be an understanding person but sometimes it really takes me a while to see things from someone else’s perspective, especially if I think I’m right. Other times it’s really easy and quite enlightening, it all depends on the time, place, person and situation.

I’d say just taking time to listen and then even taking time to understand something even if it takes a while is how I deal with misunderstandings.

Making music, in the beginning, is often playful and about discovery. How do you retain a sense of playfulness and how do you still draw surprises from tools, approaches and musical forms you may be very familiar with?

[Lawaun] I think it’s about not overthinking it. As soon as you begin to overthink music it becomes a chore. Of course, you have the mixing stage which can consist of being methodical with each decision. But I believe creating a song should be built on vibes. Because if the spirit of the song leaves the room then you've failed somewhere along the way.

[Jamal] Every time I write something and think ‘wow this is sick I’ll never write something as good as this again’ I always end up surprising myself by writing something better.

The whole process has to start with the right intention. I’d never fire up my Mac before making a beat and say to myself ‘today I need to make something that’s going to chart and make loads of money’ because you’re just going to copy what someone else has done.

I’m convinced that I still don’t have a clue what I’m really doing and that I keep having happy accidents.

Sound, song, and rhythm are all around us, from animal noises to the waves of the ocean. What, if any, are some of the most moving experiences you’ve had with these non-human-made sounds? How far would you describe them as “musical”?

[Lawaun] Recently it has been from listening to the birds. I’m currently in a garret so whenever I make music I open my windows and it's so calming to hear birds.

Musically I actually sometimes record the sounds from my window and add them as a textured layer in my song.

[Jamal] I’m a fan of going for long walks in my local area and not listening to any music. For me the sound of the wind in the trees is really soothing and to be honest even the sound of rain hitting my hood is relaxing as well. I don’t know if they are musical but it’s subjective I suppose, they are definitely soothing.

I end up forming new ideas for songs when I hear these sounds, I think it’s because they clear my head of everything I’ve heard or thought about.

There seems to be an increasing trend to capture music in algorithms, and data. But already at the time of Plato, arithmetic, geometry, and music were considered closely connected. How do you see that connection yourself? What aspects of music do you feel can be captured through numbers, and which can not?

[Lawaun] I think the algorithm can show you what's making noise and building momentum. Capturing data such as streams, playlist and identifying audiences is all things that can be achieved through these methods.

However, I don't feel like momentum necessary translates to quality which can be an issue with relying or waiting on the data. Solely using data makes it about numbers and less about the artistry. Like most things in life I think it’s all about moderation.

[Jamal] I don’t know a lot about maths, I’m not really a numbers guy. People can find a way to put a number to anything and sometimes there’s good reason for it.

The one thing people will never be able to quantify or put into an algorithm is the vibe. The vibe of a track is unique to each song and to each listener as well.

How does the way you make music reflect the way you live your life? Can we learn lessons about life by understanding music on a deeper level?

[Lawaun] Absolutely, I literally put my heart and soul into music. I express myself sonically using chords to create a mood and instruments to tell the story.

[Jamal] I think the way I make music is very in the moment and that’s quite reflective of how I live day to day. I usually just end up writing in a session or at home but it’s never planned.

I’m like this with most things I do, it can be problematic because most people need time to mentally prepare for things or to make time in their schedule. It’s something I’m trying to get better at (as in giving people a heads up) but I like the way my music naturally comes to life.

We can surround us with sound every second of the day. The great pianist Glenn Gould even considered this the ultimate delight. How do you see that yourself and what importance does silence hold?

[Lawaun] Silence is golden. I think as a creative you need those moments of silence so you can think clearly.

For me, silence is a privilege. Especially in the times we’re living in, with mental health being on the rise, being able to find peace of mind and zen is a luxury. As I got older I’ve started to value silence more and more.

[Jamal] Silence is vital for me, I’ll regularly go for weeks of just having my earphones in but nothing playing, it’s good to help me think.

Sometimes just listening to your heart beat to remind you you’re alive in the moment is important. I love silence and tranquility just as much as I love loud music.

Do you feel as though writing or performing a piece of music is inherently different from something like making a great cup of coffee? What do you express through music that you couldn’t or wouldn’t in more & mundane tasks?

[Lawaun] Yes I think the two are worlds apart. I believe you can write a song about someone doing mundane tasks as the body of the record. However, the art of music is about telling that story in a compelling way that resonates with others. You never make a cup of coffee today to drink tomorrow. However, you can write a song today that will be more relevant months if not years later.

Sam Cooke - “A Change Is Gonna Come” is a perfect example of this.



Arguably the song is as relevant today as it was back then and that's the power of music. Great music doesn’t have an expiration date.

[Jamal] I think ‘mundane’ tasks are only as boring as you make them. If you really wanted you could put as much expression into making a coffee as you could making music. Sometimes the smallest amount of effort goes into making something incredibly good, or it just happens by accident.

I think I can express myself through music in a way that I can’t through cooking and vice versa but they are both as equally as important as each other.

If you could make a wish for the future – what are developments in music you would like to see and hear?

[Lawaun] I would love to see more independent artists being able to live from their art. I would also love to see more international collaborations. I think there's so much untapped talent that doesn’t get heard and it’s a shame.

[Jamal] I wish that I keep exploring new genres as don’t get held down into one space. I hope that I can move into other creative spaces as well and bring the music with me.